Street Fighter x Tekken (1 Viewer)

[randomguy]

People just hadn't hit their breaking point yet. That or the other companies hadn't held back 30% or more of the fucking game as "DLC". People have just finally had enough of the bullshit.

this is simply not true, if it was people would be pissed at skullgirls for having only 6 characters two game modes and the rest will be paid DLC, or Namco with the DLC in SCV. Gamers are inconsistent and whiny, it's just now I realize it isn't JUST the Sonic fans. Hell let me us Angry Joe as an example. On his worst and disappointing lists for last year Rage was put on there because the PC version was bad and another game was put on because at release it was buggy though noted it had been fixed but was going on it's initial release, both of these are fair, however his GOTY was Skyrim. Skyrim was a culprit of BOTH these issues. The PS3 version was not just bad but is STILL unbeatable after so many hours and it was insanely buggy on the PC when first released. Somehow it is ok for Skyrim but not the other two games...and I don't even like Rage. I just HATE when people are inconsistent.

While I understand how the GDD generally works, I sincerely believe ALL game studios-not just Capcom need to change how they go about writing one up. In this day and age, GDD's need to be more flexible and allow developers and marketeers alike to make drastic changes on the fly and preverbially 'suck dick' to combat bad press and internet hate. As much as Capcom would like to write off missing their sales target on oversaturation of the market, most people-haters and fans alike can see that bad press and rep is what's to blame for this. Now, this could've easily been fixed if capcom's developers were given the opportunity to completely scrap the gem system after it got a scathing from the internet. Unfortunately, we're here now, gems and all.

I know it sounds stupid, but this an age where an 'internet critic' getting colourfully angry on youtube can potentially cost your game hundreds of thousands in sales. Alot of stupid, angry people play video games. These people don't understand how and why things aren't done the way they want it done. Only that it isn't happening, they're not happy about it, and they won't hesitate to throw their blind hate all over the internet, where other like-minded people hop on their hatetrains, thus creating an unstoppable force devoid of logic and reason. And until game studios change how they go about making games to keep the stupid people happy, reps and sales will continue to suffer as a result.

You have a point but considering how game production works it would be insanely hard to drop an entire system in middle of production without having to make a HUGE push back on release date and cost the company tons of money, and in the case of gems it was and still is mostly people complaining about a system they have not used(even if they bought the game and just unequipped the gems..which you can do) But yeah dropping or drasticly changing a system would be insanely time consuming and expensive and the company would not be able to profit on the game. DLC actually supports those free patches we get. Did you know a patch on the 360 costs 40,000 bucks? I am not sure how much PS3 costs but I know it is a bit cheaper(which is why PS3 versions of games tend to get patch more overall) and if a company can't make money off of a game if it was released they will kick it to the series to the curb within a heartbeat. Look at clover Studios they did make some great games but they did not sell so they got kicked to the curb and gained popularity much later after their release. Remember game development is a business. Also if you try to make your game to make EVERYONE happy you will fail. Because it is impossible to make them happy.

Also on the note of internet critics I hate most sure there are some really good and entertaining ones but I hate ones like Spoony or Angry Joe who pretend their word is law. Thankfully people like Benzai Jew Wario JonTron and PeanutButter Gamer are around and are not huge jerk dicks. But yeah I hate how people flock to those people and blindly listen to them vs trying to form their own opinion..frigging hipsters.

 

[anotherguttersnipe]

You have a point but considering how game production works it would be insanely hard to drop an entire system in middle of production without having to make a HUGE push back on release date and cost the company tons of money, and in the case of gems it was and still is mostly people complaining about a system they have not used(even if they bought the game and just unequipped the gems..which you can do) But yeah dropping or drasticly changing a system would be insanely time consuming and expensive and the company would not be able to profit on the game. DLC actually supports those free patches we get. Did you know a patch on the 360 costs 40,000 bucks? I am not sure how much PS3 costs but I know it is a bit cheaper(which is why PS3 versions of games tend to get patch more overall) and if a company can't make money off of a game if it was released they will kick it to the series to the curb within a heartbeat. Look at clover Studios they did make some great games but they did not sell so they got kicked to the curb and gained popularity much later after their release. Remember game development is a business. Also if you try to make your game to make EVERYONE happy you will fail. Because it is impossible to make them happy.

Also on the note of internet critics I hate most sure there are some really good and entertaining ones but I hate ones like Spoony or Angry Joe who pretend their word is law. Thankfully people like Benzai Jew Wario JonTron and PeanutButter Gamer are around and are not huge jerk dicks. But yeah I hate how people flock to those people and blindly listen to them vs trying to form their own opinion..frigging hipsters.

My personal opinion of the gems aside, whether people hate the gem system because it's genuinely bad or just because it's different is irrelevant. At the end of the day, people hate it, and thus it costed them sales. I mean, sure. Making such a drastic change to the system would have been severely time and resource consuming. But I think that in this case, the bad rep has done more damage for them in sales than pushing development time back could ever do. Not only that, but it will continue to hurt them. I know of people who are refusing to buy Dragon's Dogma and RE6 just because it has the big C logo on it.

 

[randomguy]

Yeah people are also anti-capcom because it is the cool thing to do. And honestly they would have lost TONS more money if they scrapped the system to the point were they would just have dropped the game entirely because it would be far to expensive to kick a system out then do all the testing to see what problems came about such a drastic change.. Which then this conversation would have been, "FUCK YOU CAPCOM FOR CANCELING THE BEST GAME EVER" and again most people who complain about the gems don't use them or have never even played the game. It's like all those people that say "X" game is the worst game ever yet they never played said game.

 

[Raden]

this is simply not true

Actually, yes, it is true, it's even been said over on Capcom's forums. Capcom has been pulling this crap for a while now, and it's only now that people are wising up and walking away. Now there are a lot of other choices than SFXT for this summer, and people are choosing those games instead.

Yeah people are also anti-capcom because it is the cool thing to do. And honestly they would have lost TONS more money if they scrapped the system to the point were they would just have dropped the game entirely because it would be far to expensive to kick a system out then do all the testing to see what problems came about such a drastic change..

I really think the whole "Rolento hard-locks the game" thing proves they don't test for shit.

 

[anotherguttersnipe]

Yeah people are also anti-capcom because it is the cool thing to do. And honestly they would have lost TONS more money if they scrapped the system to the point were they would just have dropped the game entirely because it would be far to expensive to kick a system out then do all the testing to see what problems came about such a drastic change.. Which then this conversation would have been, "FUCK YOU CAPCOM FOR CANCELING THE BEST GAME EVER" and again most people who complain about the gems don't use them or have never even played the game. It's like all those people that say "X" game is the worst game ever yet they never played said game.

What was stopping them from doing the proverbial ctrl+z and rebuilding from their E3 build. While I'm all for new and interesting things in fighting games, the general consensus from most fans was 'we want SSFIV with tekken characters and a tag system'. The flexibility I'm talking about mainly concerns allowing devs to 'ctrl z' to combat bad press. If SFxT's devs had that ability, the resulting game would've been alot easier to make, and would've given more than ample time for quality testing and bughunts.

But I suppose it's all in hindsight now.

 

[randomguy]

because programing is touchy and changing one bit of code can alter the entire game. If you had a little bit knowledge of programing you'd probably know this. Not yelling at you for not but as someone who has a little I know programing can be a biiiitch. Here are some examples of this; well look at Rolento. He was not even touched in the last patch and now he has a game killer glitch in him. The backwards flying dragons in SKYRIM pc after a patch, The game killing glitch in the 360 version of Ninja Gaiden 2, and I am sure you can think of a few yourself

also on the SSFIV but with tekken fighters note, I can hear them bitching saying that same line but instead of we wanted that it would be turned to we wanted more then that.

 

[Raden]

Okay so if he was not touched from game to patch, how does he end up making the game say "blarg im ded" when knife meets fireball? I may not be able to write code but I do know it doesn't change itself.

Or the broken diagonal inputs they still have not managed to fix?

They churn out crap like a machine because for every guy like me who gets fed up with their stuff, there's three or more who throw money at them. Personally I am of the opinionthat if you can't do your job right, you should not have that job, which is why I won't be very sad at all if THQ eats it (and it is not looking good for them at this point.)

 

[randomguy]

changes in code can affect any and all other aspects of code, if you had any programing knowledge you would know this. If you wanna learn I suggest trying C++ it's a simpler language to get an idea on how coding in general works/

If your idea of not doing your job is making a mistake then Bethesda not only should be gone but should owe people's money
also SNK would have to be taken down too..so would...almost every game company

 

[anotherguttersnipe]

because programing is touchy and changing one bit of code can alter the entire game. If you had a little bit knowledge of programing you'd probably know this. Not yelling at you for not but as someone who has a little I know programing can be a biiiitch. Here are some examples of this; well look at Rolento. He was not even touched in the last patch and now he has a game killer glitch in him. The backwards flying dragons in SKYRIM pc after a patch, The game killing glitch in the 360 version of Ninja Gaiden 2, and I am sure you can think of a few yourself

Oh, I can think of a good one. Forced Unleashed 2 has a really weird glitch. After not touching it for quite some time, I decided to boot it up again because I felt like flinging some stormtroopers around for the hell of it-only to find that once I press any attack button mid level, the game freezes for 2 seconds, and continues to do so once every ten seconds, thus making the game unplayable. I did some research to find the that it's supposedly an update to the 360 dashboard that caused the game to freakout. Strangely enough though, I've never encountered game killing glitch in NG2.....

You're right. I have no doubt that backwards coding is a pain in the ass, and I'm not gonna pretend I have even an inkling of understanding of how to write code. But when I mention 'ctrl+z' in this context, I don't necessarily mean going back and manually changing all the codes. Perhaps(hypothetically), they could've kept their early EVO build during the development stage, then when the internet went ALL CAPZ on the gem system, they could've just scrubed it, and started afresh from the EVO build. Yes, I suppose it may have pushed dev time back quite some, but then maybe not if they took the 'SSFIV with tekken characters etc etc route'. Which brings me to......

also on the SSFIV but with tekken fighters note, I can hear them bitching saying that same line but instead of we wanted that it would be turned to we wanted more then that.

I think having the tag mechanics alone would've already made it more than SSFIV. I mean, sure the gamers would've bitched about not getting more than that, but I can't help but think they would've been bitching less than they are now with our gems and the like.

The more I read the comments sections on anything related to a game, the more I'm coming to the conclusion that I'm not really a gamer.......

 

[Raden]

That is what their testers are for, so yes, the fact that this huge bug got out means they did not do their job. That's what testers do: Test stuff. To make sure it doesn't do funky things.

 

[randomguy]

welp then SNK and Bethesda should be gone. Skyrim on PS3 was unplayable after a couple hours, and Capcom vs SNK Cardbattle DS could not be beaten, one of these two was fixed though to be fair. SNK did a recall were buyers could send them their copies(i was one of these) and they would send back a fixed copy of the game and a pack of KOF 2000 cards.

 

[Raden]

And how many weeks or months did it take to fix all that then?

 

[randomguy]

it was released on April 24, 2007 the recall announced on June 6th same year and was in full affect on the 25th

 

[Raden]

so all in all, two months. Not bad considering they had to recall physical copies.

Now, how long as SFXT been out, with the diagonal problem since day one....

yeah.

 

[randomguy]

I didn't know the diagonal problem was a game killer!

actually if you wanna play the how long an issue has been in a game card then here is my trump card. How long has Skyrim been out and the PS3 issue is still there? And even the PC and 360 versions are buggy messes. The answer; November 11 2011. The first patch wasn't out til December and no the game crippling glitch unless they just released a new patch isn't fixed. Hell Bethesda even initially told PS3 customers what amounted too "You shoulda bought the PC one"

 

[Raden]

I didn't know the diagonal problem was a game killer!

actually if you wanna play the how long an issue has been in a game card then here is my trump card. How long has Skyrim been out and the PS3 issue is still there? And even the PC and 360 versions are buggy messes. The answer; November 11 2011. The first patch wasn't out til December and no the game crippling glitch unless they just released a new patch isn't fixed. Hell Bethesda even initially told PS3 customers what amounted too "You shoulda bought the PC one"

Right, because who needs silly things like jumping forward or backward, crouch blocking, or even throwing a fireball. None of that is important in a fighting game, you're right.

But seriously, you're right about Skyrim though., That's fucking ridiculous and would be a great way to make sure the company I gave money to for a game would see no more of it.

 

[anotherguttersnipe]

Didn't they fix the jumping issue? I mean, I haven't had any problems jumping backwards/forwards for a while.

 

[Someone92]

Okay so if he was not touched from game to patch, how does he end up making the game say "blarg im ded" when knife meets fireball?

Simple. Each programmer usually codes certain functions and tells the other programmers only how to properly call his functions and which results they will return; the other programmers don't actually know what exactly the function of the other programmer does.
Now, if you change one function it may break another function because it calls this changed functions in a false way; noticing and tracking down those kind of errors can be a very tedious work.

 

[randomguy]

^
thanks I am not the best with words

yeah the jumping was fixed ages ago, cause I don't even remember it being an issue(no seriously I don't and I tend to jump a lot when playing 2D style fighters) but yeah the fireball knife is an honest to god issue, which is being fixed in the next patch due out in June. If honestly the next patch adds an issue to the game(another game killer) I am going to be inclined to agree with you guys a bit more and think Capcom is rushing their shit out too fast and should take a step back and maybe take a bit more time in development. To be fair though I still remember SSF4 when it first came out has it's share of issues and initiates which is why I am willing to be more patient

hell i remember how SF2 was unbalanced before

 

[Raden]

Simple. Each programmer usually codes certain functions and tells the other programmers only how to properly call his functions and which results they will return; the other programmers don't actually know what exactly the function of the other programmer does.
Now, if you change one function it may break another function because it calls this changed functions in a false way; noticing and tracking down those kind of errors can be a very tedious work.

Oh okay, I see... so like, say someone made a mistake with Rolento's knife somehow, and someone else fixes it, but now something else is calling on what might now be an incorrect or even missing variable, and it doesn't know how to handle it so it locks the game as now there's no "what happens next" event... I see. Man, it really can be that easy, can't it? Damn.