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How much damage?

Discussion in 'Ryona' started by Stuelpner_Karl, Jan 28, 2014.

  1. Stuelpner_Karl

    Stuelpner_Karl Avid Affiliate

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    Looking through older threads, I came across a couple of discussions, started by some guys who seem to be not active here anymore.

    http://www.ryonani.com/whats-your-fetish/2138-brutal-beating-ryona.html
    http://www.ryonani.com/whats-your-fetish/2018-loss-limbs.html


    This makes me wonder how much damage, especially permanent damage, is appropriate in your fantasy?


    The most permanent damage is probably death.
    Death may be the conclusion of a brutal fight, the only way to keep a strong opponent down for good. Or it's simply a way to get rid of sentries and other unimportant henchpeople, without wasting time on the question what to do with them after the fight. Thus killing someone can be either a show of respect or a show of disrespect.

    Another thing are crippling injuries, like a broken spine, the mentioned loss of body parts or a disfigured appearance.
    Again, the importance of the victim often makes a difference. For major opponents, it may be meant as a punishment worse than death, while some type of hero or heroine literally cuts through an army of Zako, leaving them lying on the ground helpless, without caring for them enough to either kill or save them.

    To a lesser extent, there may be the contrast between simple defeat and injuries, like broken bones or severe concussions, that affect them for a while after the fight. But eventually they will recover.

    Not to forget: Sending the defeated to jail or selling them into slavery, or magically changing them into something different.


    So, how much damage do the Ryona fans want to see or imagine?
    Does it make a difference if the receiver is good or evil, a developed character or a minion, and (if you are not limited to female scenes), male or female?
    Are there other aspects, like the character's age or if she is beautiful/hot in your eyes, making a difference?
     
  2. Unrelated

    Unrelated Club Regular Ryonani Teamster

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    I've been pretty vocal in the past about being against any kind of permanent/long-lasting damage-- blood, broken bones, death, etc. are all pretty big turn-offs for me.

    Bad-End scenarios can be alright-- capture, slavery, transformation (depends on the transformation of course), old-school cliffhanger endings are all okay.

    It is a fetish purely grounded in fantasy (a large number of us are here because of video games/comics/cartoons), and I prefer that the violence stay that way. For example, a Bane vs Catwoman scenario that has her bent over his knee, thrown through walls, etc., she gets weaker and weaker until she is KOed, then wakes up later sore and exhausted but with no other major ill effects, though she might find herself chained to a pole somewhere as the scene fades out...
     
  3. thesteedman

    thesteedman Casual Client Ryonani Teamster

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    I'm a little like Unrelated myself, though I'm a little more tolerant of long-lasting damage within reason. Blood and death are certainly very undesirable, and most broken bones too unless its the back/spine given my preference of Ryona. If the back is broken however I really hate it if its permanent or leads to the female being paralyzed or death. I kinda like the "they'll make a full recovery" kind and not paralyzed. The times I've had characters receive such a vicious injury in RP's, there's always been access to some form of advance healing that has them back to full strength within a week rather then over long months.

    I like knockout endings, and I've always had a spot for lost fights that lead to a capture. Part of it because it guarantees the survival of the victim, that and I'm just a sucker for my preferred ryona when it leads to defeat and capture, since there is always the promise of more soon after. I also like it when the woman who has been on the receiving end of all this, manages to at least get some form of revenge or at least win the day after an escape or the such. I always like happy endings XD
     
  4. randomguy

    randomguy Swell Supporter Ryonani Teamster

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    I am similar to Steed. I am a bit more tolerant to blood and death but all my stuff shys away from it. I think I stated at some point that nobody dies in my Xna sets and if a character ever does I would state it. I only used blood once in the one Pai set but again she is not dead. I tend to use video game logic of the character can be put through hell and back but in the end she will be ok. She may get carried off(I tend to end my sets these days with the girl being carried off.
     
  5. onlinehero

    onlinehero Swell Supporter

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    Very little. More interested in mental damage than about bruises, broken bones or blood. I like the heroines get hurt, bot not permanently. They will always be ok physically in the end, but shamed of their defeat :)
     
  6. Stuelpner_Karl

    Stuelpner_Karl Avid Affiliate

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    To answer my own question...
    For me, the favorite receiver is someone who joined an evil organisation voluntarily and for selfish reasons. But unlike the bosses and probably the majority of the other minor baddies, she (or sometimes he) is rather likeable as a person, outside of the job. And I prefer to imagine the scene through that henchperson's eyes.

    I like over-the-top brutal and funny stuff, like "Asterix & Obelix" or "Home alone", as well as "Die hard" scenarios, where "ten little baddies" unseccessfully try to kill the hero or heroine, until "...there is none."

    Things may get really painful and embarrassing, like this:
    Candygirl VS. The Purple Vixens by garageman45 on deviantART

    Due to the ambivalence of the likeable baddie's character, permanent damage, other than knocked out teeth or burned off hair, would give it a tragic note.

    But the possibility that FATALITY can happen to anyone adds suspense to a story.

    [​IMG]
     
  7. meepmeep

    meepmeep Casual Client Ryonani Teamster

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    There's nothing sexy about broken limbs or permanent physical damage. The only permanent damage should be to the heroine's confidence/spirit/psyche/reputation. Bruises and bleeding can be very hot in moderation, though ultimately there's nothing hotter to me than seeing a humbled heroine or fighter crying tears of defeat and humiliation.

    However, this is just me, and I certainly respect others' preferences.
     
  8. Snowballs

    Snowballs Casual Client Ryonani Teamster

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    I'm a fan of both. In terms of my Ryona-fetish spectrum, I enjoy the live-action content a little bit more because I understand that it is fake and consented. It's odd but knowing that both parties planned the scene is a kinky to me, especially when the actresses sell their humiliation and pain; this is why I don't mind venturing more into rape-fantasy or chloroforming type of content because I understand that she is consenting the actor to take control of them. I am a healthcare worker and seeing real people in pain hurts me and turns me off.

    In terms of animated ryona, I'm usually okay with gore/death because I understand that the character is coming back. Unlike live-action ryona, I like my game ryona to be a bit more intimate and brutal. I want them to lose their esteem and add insult to injury, which is probably why I enjoy afterpin-moves or victory poses in wrestling matches. The amount of gore really depends though, I guess I'm not into the guts or blood flying out but I do enjoy how death scenes basically make them a rag doll. I enjoy some of AngelCorps' material but its very hit or miss with me. Just reiterating that the death scenes to me, are really nice if it's like a last insult-to-injury scenario similar to Mortal Kombat's Fatalities.

    Post-victory Hogtie >>> Death
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 31, 2014
  9. glutton

    glutton Potential Patron

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    Just injured and temporarily downed, but able to get back up and make a comeback.
     
  10. L Deimos

    L Deimos Potential Patron

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    Honestly, I've been extremely disappointed with ryona. Either it's too soft or too gory, It seems like not many people like the middle ground. I like girls who get pretty brutally beaten, but not extreme Guro. Bruises, blood, cuts, swelling and broken bones (to a degree), are acceptable to me, but most of the time it just ends up being some lame unrealistic rape. I was hoping the Zeus pictures would provide me with my fix, but it's just too fake and soft for my liking. I've pretty much just given up on ryona all together. A good ryona too me was Videl vs Spopovich from DBZ. Its sad that after all these years or searching, that scene is the only thing I got,(in video form at least).
     
  11. Psythe

    Psythe Potential Patron

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    For me physical damage really takes a back seat to 'psychological ryona' and BDSM themes, mainly humiliation, enslavement and bondage, etc for the defeated, preferably in a way that the defeated can't come back from, such that her career/goals/mission are a failure, and her only existence is as a conquered slave to her enemy. That theme speaks to me with a bull horn, regardless of the level of lasting physical damage that got her there.

    To answer your question more directly, I actually tend to prefer that broken bones, blood and gore etc be kept to a minimum, both because I tend to lose interest in a story if it 's mainly or only about how she's being beaten up, and not more about her being dominated, and because I'm generally not a fan of physical brutality for female characters, as it reminds me too much of real life abuse.

    And as for how the genders of the people involved affect what I like in a story, there are a few points:

    If the aggressor is male, I have a much less physical damage maximum than if the aggressor is female, for reasons already touched on above.

    For female-on-male(gyaku) I don't really have an opinion, since I'm not into it. I think it's as equally valid as straight ryona, but it's not my cuppa tea, so I'll leave this one for others to opine on :D

    As for rape, female-on-female's alright, male-on-female absolutely not(the only possible exception that's not really rape is if say she voluntarily made a bet with a guy that she'd do something sexual if she lost the fight, thus giving prior consent to a possible future. Other than that, no.) And for female-on-male rape, while it doesn't bother me, again it's not my cuppa tea.

    For death, it can be appealing in certain stories with certain circumstances only if the aggressor is female, such as an execution after defeat and capture, though I'd always prefer an enslavement ending. And if the aggressor is male no death.

    Those are some of my thoughts.
     
  12. L Deimos

    L Deimos Potential Patron

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    I wish I liked your style or ryona. The things you like are much easier to find and in comparison, are abundant. It seems like most people seem to prefer much softer forms of ryona.

    I could never buy a female being overly aggresive to another female, because women aren't really violent by nature. The most a woman would do is slap the other woman. Men by nature are usually more aggressive and like to throw around their dominance so rape, torture, etc..., would be much more likely to happen.
     
  13. randomguy

    randomguy Swell Supporter Ryonani Teamster

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    at my high school the chicks fought more then men. Also going to be honest when I have seen tow guys fight irl usually it ends when someone is knocked down...not so much when two women go at it.

    as for damage in what I like, I like softer usually little or no blood though humiliation is a plus. In my video sets I tends to treat them like fighting game characters where a backbreaker is not crippling in shit and worse I do is usually KO in my stuff.
     
  14. Tonug

    Tonug Avid Affiliate Ryonani Teamster

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    yup. It's definitely softer now because people see stuff like the videl fight and get uncomfortable or complain, and they stop making it. Like the new tomb raider for example. People complained it was wrong see a woman die brutally, so you can bet tomb raider 2 will be tamer.
     
  15. morosenoodle

    morosenoodle Avid Affiliate

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    I'd actually put a twist on OP's quote guy; I like to pity the girl, AND I like her to die. Death is Best Ryona, but tragic death is better still. I originally got into ryona, paradoxically, because I didn't like it, and the more I didn't want the character to die, the hotter it was when she got killed.

    Cliffhanger endings are nice, too, especially when it's clear that the girl is in dire peril, and has little (or no) chance of coming out of her predicament alive (example: the Game Over sequence from Final Fight, which cuts away seconds before death). Crippling injuries seem like a wasted opportunity to me, and "soft" Bad Ends, like slavery or mind-control, are, in my opinion, actually worse than the classic knock-out ending. If you don't want to go for a really hard ending, then stick to a really open soft ending. It's like Mr Miyagi once said: Bad End "yes", or Bad End "no". Bad End "guess so", squished just like grape.





    I don't know about that. People were complaining about Lara Croft's humungous tits since day one, and it took more than fifteen years of bitching from the Anti-Fun Police before they finally shrunk 'em down. And people complained about the violence in Mortal Kombat FAR more than they ever bitched about the TR reboot - hell, they even took it to Congress - but it's been more than twenty years now and the series is gorier than ever. Controversy sells, especially amongst the Tomb Raider's target demographics, so if I were designing the next Tomb Raider game, I'd make it even more brutal than the last one!
     
  16. Mystral Kiss

    Mystral Kiss Potential Patron

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    I agree with Psythe. When writing erotic ryona, I like going the psychological route. I can enjoy it when taken to the extreme (e.g., failed mission, lasting public humiliation, and enslavement), and it's the kind of stuff I like to hunt for when looking for ryona.

    As for physical damage, I usually don't like anything lasting. Permanent injury is a turn-off. However, I would not mind situations where brutal damage takes place in some fantasy setting where it is temporary:


    • A fight in virtual reality
    • A realm where healing magic will fully mend injuries or restore life
    • A fantasy world that allows for "respawning," in some sense

    In these kinds of situations, I can accept the concept of a grievous wound, and it doesn't mean the victim becomes crippled or killed. It also means that repeated fights or rematches are perfectly OK and natural :)

    This resonates with me too.
     
  17. fox4562

    fox4562 Potential Patron

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    I agree with others in enjoying the psychological aspects, humiliation and submission particularly. Anything resulting in permanent damage tends to be a turn off, maybe because my fantasies include enslavement.

    It also depends a great deal on my mood. Sometimes i have a darker streak and i like a bit more hardcore violence, other times i lean toward the lighter end of the spectrum, and lean more toward playful and comedic.
     
  18. Viridian

    Viridian Potential Patron

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    For me as a female Ryona enthusist it's Psychological and sympathetic. I have a quirk in my head that associates the defeat and humiliation of my heroines with the thrill most people get just by viewing porn or something. As one might imagine, this means that I do not approve of the more misogynistic end of the fetish. in the first of the OP's example post (not accusing the poster of being a misogynist here, simply explaining that it creates a misogynistic image given the short snippet available) the reason I would rather sympathize with the girls is because it creates a heroine for me to empathize with and makes that heroine's fall more profound in a way that just happens to turn me on. I imagine myself in that position where I am the hero who just can't quite pull out the win, where as viewing such a thing from to far an outside perspective is essentially me watching another woman brutally beaten without remorse which provides no thrill whatsoever (As an example I am only intrigued by the heroic types. To mundane a heroine 'office worker/maid/even most wrestling champions are not thrilling for me). So I guess my answer to that would be that the majority of Ryonani's frequenters are NOT misogynists and as such do not view the beating of a woman as something that is approachable without empathy. Not that I am any kind of authority on the matter.
     
  19. Cuntington

    Cuntington Vivacious Visitor

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    Personally not a big fan of death or the victim being horribly mangled; a KO is good enough (I like it when heroines/villainesses seem ridiculously indestructible and seem to come out of these things with little more than a splitting headache) and even better if deep down, she actually likes it. :p
     
  20. Mardion

    Mardion Swell Supporter

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    I'm okay with any amount of damage tbh. I love seeing grabs that irl would break the girls' bones (Dead Or Alive's Tina has a lot of them) or those that actually do, like the Mortal Kombat's X-ray moves. I also liked in the original Resident Evil watching Jill eaten by zombies, having her neck chewed by zombie dogs or get insta-killed by a boulder etc etc. In fact, there was a period where I loved seeing my character getting insta-killed when she wasn't supposed to be, like when I was playing the 1v1 fighting game Cardinal Syn and my final (female) opponent turned into a dragon, and as I was fighting normally the dragon suddenly caught my fighter with her teeth and wiggled her around until she was torn in half... I really enjoyed that segment mainly because it was so unexpected (and unfair). So yeah, it's no holds barred AFAIC :-P

    Boy, are you wrong on that one... there are several instances irl in which a fight between two girls is more brutal and violent than one between guys would be! But that's a story for another topic.